Sci-fi sucks ?

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Troyen
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by Troyen » Thu Feb 18, 2016 4:17 am

jack1974 wrote:Some good points. Maybe to make a successful sci-fi game I should focus on male audience (just for those games) but in general I don't like doing this.
Please don't do this. I hate technobabble too and I'm bored of the "soldier saves the galaxy" stories that are so prominent.
Katicflis wrote:There's too many variables. It may be the art.
I think the art is a bigger deal than the writing. I don't pick up a game if I don't like the art. The writing determines whether I stick with the game to the end (or check back for sequels/other games from the publisher). Or even which parts of the game I explore, though even then, the art is a big influence on romance paths.

Probably half of the WW games I've passed over have been for art reasons (including Bionic Heart), even more so than game type. But you also did a poll recently where people rated the components of a game with different importance. So, it really is tough to say with so many possible variables.

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Oniyuri
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by Oniyuri » Thu Feb 18, 2016 7:28 am

Just chiming in as another female player ^_^

Although these days I would find it difficult to rank genres based on my preferences, since story/characters, gameplay, and art (I find the latter more important when it comes to visual novels than other games) take precedence over setting for me, a few years ago I would easily have said that fantasy and sci-fi are my favourite.

Granted, I don't enjoy it when a sci-fi story gets too technical (I don't mind if it is lore that you can read separately). And not because I necessarily find it difficult or confusing, but when I read a novel, play a game or watch a show/movie, I want to enjoy it for the story (technobabble - sensible or not, detracts from that). I think it has more to do with the mind-set I have when trying to experience a story vs. reading something technical (which causes me to be more critical and analytic).

I have very few female gamer friends and I'll admit that they prefer fantasy and adventure, but they are in no way against sci-fi. For them as well, story and characters are the most important aspects of a game (and romanceable characters are a bonus). Although my other female acquaintances may find something like Star Wars acceptable, they generally don't like sci-fi, but - and this is a big but - they are also not gamers.

Personally, when it comes to visual novels at least, I will far more easily buy one that has a strong focus on romance and a female player character (I would even go so far as to ignore a mediocre story if the writing and art style are to my liking - at least while there is still a shortage of otome VNs in the market). Lacking that, the story would have to immediately pull me in or it would have to have some other aspect that attracts me (could even be a gameplay mechanic). There are also some factors that would make me skip a VN regardless (or it would take a lot of convincing for me to try it) and none if it has to do with genre (in terms of sci-fi, fantasy, adventure, and so on).

For instance, Jisei/Kansei/Yousei from sakevisual immediately drew me because the characters had psychic powers (and it feels like there are far too few games that feature that) even though you play as a male protagonist (and in this instance it greatly helps that it doesn't have dating elements). Looking at another example, I am absolutely crazy about mechas, but I can't bring myself to give Sunrider a chance because of the male protagonist and harem combination. And I haven't given Bionic Heart a try, since I pretty much filed it under the same category after first seeing it years ago (the male protagonist combined with the art style just caused a bunch of preconceived notions, although I really know I should give it a try considering your other games). As for PSCD, I couldn't get into it (I tried the demo) because of the art style (I just highly prefer a more anime style and to a lesser extend a comic style - so it's nothing against the artist).

So, the short version? Personally, it wouldn't be the genre or setting that makes me avoid a visual novel, but other factors (primarily art, writing style and romanceable characters if applicable).

Well, all that aside, I am looking forward to your future games! ^_^
lanawinst wrote:I'd even go as far as wishing to be rid of the typical VN gameplay features (stats and having a route by character) because it sometimes detracts me from the story and doesn't feel natural. I'm not sure if you know about Aloners, from Sonnet 009? The fact that the game adapts to your personality and that you define who the MC is with your choices all along the story is makes it feel so much more natural, and personal. I never remember caring as much about a VN character than I did with Trash because I was invested in the story, and it was no longer about making the right choices to win the guy but about experiencing the story at his side.
I really couldn't agree more with this! Absolutely loved Aloners!

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jack1974
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by jack1974 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:04 am

That's interesting, that so many people decide about a VN based on art. I always thought it was the case, but wasn't sure.
Now I can get back writing my own games! :mrgreen: Haha I'm joking of course.
I also wonder why I keep making game demos, if people decide to pass on a game just looking at the screenshots or reading the description. Maybe I should do like 90% of other indies and give up demos completely... for sure would save me a lot of time and money.

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IotaOne
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by IotaOne » Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:28 am

Women do have other preferences within Sci-fi stories. Altough the majority of readers and authors of stories are male, there are considerably more female authors of urban fantasy, paranormal romance and young-adult fiction (there is even an English Wikipedia entry about it).
Anyway, the analytical analysis would only matter if the age, expected total number of customers etc. could be factored in, which still is quite irrelevant since the general customer base of Science Fiction is way smaller than the one of fantasy if you dont come up with a mass effect stunt. By the way, more men than women read fantasy too, but i didnt mention it since it was not the topic.
"Truth is like poetry. And most people f*cking hate poetry."

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SimonStardust
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by SimonStardust » Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:43 am

jack1974 wrote:BTW a game in which you're a researcher in an alien planet it's actually an awesome idea!! I am writing this down for future use! 8) could be mixed with RPG or sim/strategy gameplay and be very interesting indeed.
It's great that my idea was actually an interesting one. xD
Glad I could be of any help. Even if it wasn't exactly about the topic in general.
I'm looking forward to see what will happen to the idea in the distant future. ^^
Beware! Peerons ahead! xD

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jack1974
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by jack1974 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:46 am

You're welcome :)
Regarding the topic, now I feel I have gained a knowledge on par with Jon Snow :lol: (for those unfamiliar with GoT, it's the guy often associated with the meme "you know nothing, Jon Snow").

Since in practice it's all too based on personal tastes, and if I look at my sci-fi games, most have that grim/dark aura (dark backgrounds or themes like Bionic Heart). And since depends also on the art style... too many variables to consider!

I guess I'll just keep doing as always, making new games hoping that the result will meet people's expectations :)

kadakithis
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by kadakithis » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:42 am

jack1974 wrote:That's interesting, that so many people decide about a VN based on art. I always thought it was the case, but wasn't sure.
Now I can get back writing my own games! :mrgreen: Haha I'm joking of course.
I also wonder why I keep making game demos, if people decide to pass on a game just looking at the screenshots or reading the description. Maybe I should do like 90% of other indies and give up demos completely... for sure would save me a lot of time and money.
I hate to say this, but yeah demos are generally thought to be a bad investment. There are 3 options with demos1) It doesn't change anyones mind 2) it is good enough to convince someone who would not have bought it to buy the game 3) People who would have bought the game decide not to buy it.

With your demos farther ahead than the actual game and the general statistics that 3 is more likely than 2, and the added resources, demos don't do much more than build hype.

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jack1974
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by jack1974 » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:52 am

Yes but I'll keep doing them, since I just realized that I use the demo activation. If I was doing two separate demo/full files like other indies do, then I could save time/money. But the way I'm doing it, I wouldn't save anything :)

Troyen
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by Troyen » Thu Feb 18, 2016 8:48 pm

kadakithis wrote:
jack1974 wrote:That's interesting, that so many people decide about a VN based on art. I always thought it was the case, but wasn't sure.
Now I can get back writing my own games! :mrgreen: Haha I'm joking of course.
I also wonder why I keep making game demos, if people decide to pass on a game just looking at the screenshots or reading the description. Maybe I should do like 90% of other indies and give up demos completely... for sure would save me a lot of time and money.
I hate to say this, but yeah demos are generally thought to be a bad investment. There are 3 options with demos1) It doesn't change anyones mind 2) it is good enough to convince someone who would not have bought it to buy the game 3) People who would have bought the game decide not to buy it.

With your demos farther ahead than the actual game and the general statistics that 3 is more likely than 2, and the added resources, demos don't do much more than build hype.
?

There's also a 4: people on the fence decide to go for it.

kadakithis
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Re: Sci-fi sucks ?

Post by kadakithis » Thu Feb 18, 2016 11:09 pm

That is part of 2, while the opposite is part of 3.

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