josipa24 wrote:I'm gonna try tying this whole thing in the same post, because we both got some new info (Word of God
) and because judging by your last posts we seem to be mostly in agreement over Chambara.
Agreed. Since our disagreement has been narrowed due to Aleema's post, I believe I'll be able to keep these new replies much shorter than the previous ones.
P_Tigras wrote: I'm not convinced of this. She wasn't born human, and to an alien creature human emotion would just as likely seem fickle and illusory as real and enduring.
Jul is not Chambara. Chambara is still human, and has completely human emotions.
Again, a difference in perception here. I don't see fully sentient beings as something other to humans, even if they're demons. They might have different morals, or be saddled with a need to kill, or have a very dfferent perception of the world, but they'd still have emotions like any other being.
I'm not sure if you consider cats and dogs sentient, I certainly do. They have the ability to feel, to perceive the world around them, and they are conscious. Furthermore I've encountered a few cats and dogs that strike me as more intelligent than some of the people I've known. It's a real pity they can't talk. Nevertheless there is a reason why housecats don't exceed 20lbs or so while dogs can approach 200. It would be highly dangerous to keep a 200lb mountain lion or even a 60lb lynx in one's home. Forget about a 600lb Siberian tiger. Felines have very strong predatory instincts that are still capable of triggering, regardless of how much they love you. Look at what happened to the famed tiger trainer Roy Horne. A demon would be even worse, felines at least don't have an instinct to murder, only to hunt and pounce on things smaller, or lower, than they are. Nevertheless plenty of otherwise sweet housecats figure out the killing part and learn to enjoy supplementing their diet of cat food with the even tastier fresh meat that they catch and kill themselves.
I never meant to make it seem like I thought Jul was the same as Chambara (even though I still think we can draw a few parallels) and I don't think she's 'nice deep down but hiding it'. But when I reread my posts now I can see why you got this impression.
My thoughts were more about her romace path and the way I think she could connect with someone 'one-on-one', not her world view. I honestly don't think she cares much at all about others' wellbeing, I see her more a a chaotic neutral, and I don't think that will ever change, even if she ends up in a relationship with the protagonist.
I largely agree, but I think the odds are that she's going to start out chaotic evil, with the possibility existing for her to shift to chaotic neutral.
P_Tigras wrote: You're making a lot of assumptions here.
Oh yeah, I'm pulling most of this out of thin air
I'm a writer, i get carried away. I know it may very well not be true, and it probably isn't, but it's interesting to talk about, at least to me.
Fair enough.
P_Tigras wrote: Correct me if I'm mistaken, but the gist of your argument seems to be that like vampires these days, demons are just another misunderstood and persecuted minority. They're just people with cool powers and slightly different dietary requirements. Treat them with love and many of them will become loving beings.
Not quite. I thought the baser demons(the earth and water demons and the creepy purple thing that has devour ability) had an urge to feed off of the other races (like an animal instict), and these two parties were locked in a war for so long that there was no going back. What colored them evil was our perception of them, because we were being attacked. And to their eyes we're just prey with really large teeth.
I thought the demons higher up the evolution chain (like Jul), were the same as humans in a way - some evil, some douches, some not - but they're not born wrong. They're still sentient, have a choice of action, so if they choose to kill then they're accountable.
I was just thinking about what it'd be like to be born into that sort of company and what effect it might have.
Interesting. This has been an increasingly common development with Vampires, Werewolves, Witches, Orcs, and less often, Demons. Personally I like having demons and the overwhelming majority of Vampires and Orcs stay evil. I like my demons and vampires bad to the bone with overwhelmingly strong predatory urges, although having one or two individuals attempting to fight their predatory natures can make for fun RP as well, as long as they're rare exceptions, and not always entirely successful.
P_Tigras wrote:I think it very likely that Jul needs to see such a connection in action over an extended period of time before she'll realize it's something solid that she wants for herself enough to try and change her behavior. I strongly suspect that this won't happen until she becomes the protagonist's prisoner in Loren 2 and has the opportunity to observe party interactions for awhile. At least this is how I'd probably approach writing it were the task mine. I grant that it's not the only possibility however, and Aleema may well decide to go with something else.
*Nods head* I thougth she might have felt a - maybe not a need before for this sort of thing - but an inkling for it. I don't think it would be a conscious thought however, more like something buried and forgotten, but your way seems likely, too. It's Aleema's call.
While your theory is possible, If she has noticed anything prior to Loren 2, I'm inclined to believe that she's most likely rationalized it away. To a powerful demon like her, a human would be just an inferior subcreature whose primary value would be as food, with perhaps some secondary value as a slave or toy. And yep, it's Aleema's call.
Nope, I cna't do it in one post
lol, that's why I didn't try either.
. Even if my impression is different.
