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I'm screwing the megapost idea and dividing it into smaller discussions about its subtopics instead this one is written from a SotW act1-2 perspective.

Resource management
I find it a very antiquated design concept that mana is a problem at lower levels and abundant at higher ones. I don't find it one bit awesome to be 80% restricted to basic attacks for hours upon hours of playtime. Using my abilities is fun. Battles should be balanced around me using them. I want to be pondering how to best use them to win each battle, not how much I can afford to use to have enough mana for the next five to follow. That typically results in a lot of basic attacks, abilities only from characters who can replenish their mana (Krimm, Chalassa, Vaelis) and only the most efficient spells out of anyone else (usually heals). The mana at least isn't so bad that I couldn't blow the full mana bar for a speedy victory in most fights. Anyway...

I want to talk about Rage, Krimm's ability that grants her mana when she is hit or hits someone. This works out really well, it has me trying to make her trade blows as much as possible. Yet it's not a guarantee she'll always have mana. If nobody wants to hit her and she can't multi-hit, she's only gonna melee and get 5% mana back per turn. So it's mana management but not infinite mana. That's great.

Abilities have set costs, but our mana pools grow constantly. With each level and each point in will. This means it gets easier and easier for Krimm to handle her mana, because that 5% mana is going to give her more and more absolute mana as her pool grows. This is bad. Growing mana pools are bad. The larger your mana pool, the more effective any % regen will be. It's not just Rage, there's taverns, there's half-day rest, there's Meditation (Chalassa) and the most infamous one, Jariel's Vigorous Sonata. But it cuts both ways. If I had a level 2 Krimm, I would not teach her Rage. It would be awful with that mana pool. I might be tempted to take some points in will and take Rage at level 4, and maybe that will work out. Yet as I level up, her mana pool will grow, to the point she'll always have mana because the 5% from Rage become so much absolute mana. And at that point I'll be wishing I hadn't taken those points of will, and I might make a mental note to really suffer through the small mana pool until level ups have made it decent, so that I can have the perfect stats for that damnable endboss.

If we look at Vaelis' Recovery, that is a more acceptable ability. The size of your mana pool doesn't determine its effectiveness. I think however it should restore way more than 10/turn, as I'm sitting in it constantly and even then holding back on using abilities. A better design would be like 30/turn, an even shorter delay and no cost for stances, so that I would sit in that stance for mana and swap into the offensive stance when I want to spend it.

But this is under the turn system, and we need to look at it from the global timer system perspective. Regen will no longer be measured in points per turn but points per time unit on that clock. So if you take a short action, you get less regen, and a long action lets you get more. With that being said, here come my ideas for Loren 2 resource management:

1. Each character has a means of replenishing mana. It can be getting hit, it can be delivering hits in general, it can be only specific attacks, it can just be a flat passive regen, you could have an ability to give up offense/defense for more regen.
2. Characters have abilities that cost both more and less than their average regen.
3. Mana pools are static. Will increases the power of your regen abilities (or just your passive regen if it's too hard to program). This is needed since...
4. Speed will make your actions faster, so you'll get less regen between them.
5. No character can end up in a situation where they are both out of mana and means of replenishing it.

what about dropping a mana pool altogether and only use the cool-down period Jack mentions quite often?

I think that would be the best idea honestly. Could also be a combo of the two, cooldown + mana. But cooldown seems essential to me at this point to make sure the game is balanced IMHO.

your games don't need more rules (attributes, resources, slots, resistances, pools, ...) but less :D

You know before we're running wild suggesting new mechanics shouldn't we decide what the problem is that we are trying to solve with resource mechanics is in the first place? Then we can decide what kind of mechanic is best suited for solving it. Until we know I propose simply dropping the resource mechanic without a replacement.

Speed will make your actions faster, so you'll get less regen between them.

Reasonable assumption but probably not true for the sequel. I'm thinking about changing it to an opposed attribute.

(or just your passive regen if it's too hard to program).

No static regeneration, can only be done by effects.

Anima_ wrote:No static regeneration, can only be done by effects.

no more SP/HP regen items? or enemies with a fixed +n HP per turn? a rather harsh break from the current model...

Yeah, there are a few problems with the global clock and static regeneration. Nothing that wouldn't be unsolvable of course, but it would be a lot of work for a mechanic I consider detrimental to the game. Instead I have been considering trigger based SP recovery. It adds a new tactical dimension to the game and is probably more satisfying for the player as well.

Anima_ wrote:shouldn't we decide what the problem is that we are trying to solve with resource mechanics is in the first place?

I want to win my battles using abilities, not basic attacks. I also don't want to be able to "graduate out" of mana, like I feel I do when I have casinod some SPR and picked up Jariel (along with the raw mana pool I have then). It comes at the price of whatever that SPR gear cost could boost instead and the second best song Jariel has, but that's a deal I happily make. That's the problem according to yayswords.

Okay so you want:

I want to win my battles using abilities, not basic attacks.

Then why use a mana system in the first place, since it's only purpose is to restrict your use of abilities and consequently forces you into basic attacks? What problem are you trying to solve with it?

I posted both sides of the problem with the system. Early on it's almost only basic attacks. With some SPR and Jariel mana is barely a resource. Somewhere inbetween I'm considering which abilities are worth using.

If all my (druid) spells cost 5 SP more but my Magic Bolt restored 15 SP that would feel totally different. Mana replenishment becomes an active choice, not just "acquire regen from gear and/or Riley/Jariel, then take the fastest cheapest turn possible to let it tick". If Magic Bolt restores 15 SP it feels like more than a basic attack.

A well designed mana system rewards a player for knowing when to spend the mana and when to build it up, but building it up has very poor mechanics right now. Meditation and Recovery have the right ideas (even if I find them too weak) - you pop them when you can live with Chalassa or Vaelis not being at their best, so that they have the mana when you need them to own.