Well you know what, I'll start showing the Roger Steel art starting from tonight (my time, so a few hours from now).

I want to see what people think. It's same artist but the style is quite different from PSCD.

My wife for example liked it, while didn't like PSCD too. She thought it was a different artist

Well I for one liked the art better than manga style art, but I know I am in the minority there.

I just started a thread for Roger Steel, so those who didn't like PSCD art maybe will like more RS? http://www.winterwolves.net/viewtopic.php?f=38&t=3814

Just for my curiosity, what you think of an art style like Vinegaria (Moacube's artist) ? that is better? (I think is amazing but at this point I wonder about my tastes haha).

Love her style. I have the original Phantasmat, Cinders & Solstice and her art's absolutely gorgeous. (The word 'love' there should be surrounded by little thumbing hearts )



But let's say in jest that you would make a fanservice porn game with her art but with a horrible plot...I wouldn't buy it. In my personal book, you can save a game with art I don't care about with excellent writing, but you can't save horrible (depends on tastes as well) writing with gorgeous art. For example, I would not have bought Roommates if I hadn't played the demo. The art (and same goes for the the sound track) are so not my cup of tea, but I liked the writing so much that I bought both Anne and Max's routes and enjoyed the game a LOT. Despite the other factors. (And seriously, since I mentioned Roommates--- we human females and males have nipples. There's nothing more family-friendly than nipples on mammals. Ask any baby getting breastfed. )



EDIT: Sorry for the offtopicness. Just to throw my half a penny into the actual issue, maybe also the abundance of games offered makes people less likely to even try out demos for games that do not sit *exactly* in their niche.

Haha Vin would never make a fanservice porn game

I think her art would be perfect in a horror game (well, Phantasmat... heh).

Even if one day I do a fanservice game, the plot would still rule! You can be sure of it

Just for my curiosity, what you think of an art style like Vinegaria (Moacube's artist) ? that is better? (I think is amazing but at this point I wonder about my tastes haha).

Oh my gravy! Yes that's much better.

I think her art would be perfect in a horror game.."

Or Rodger Steel,Or PS2...

Leonardo DaVinci could release art for a visual novel and people would be disappointed it's not manga enough for them. I really liked Dennis art -- sad not everyone can appreciate alternate styles.

Hahaha

The problem is that if it was just my forums, I could understand. But the very disappointing Steam reception... not sure what to think!

I plan to buy the game, but unfortunately money has been tight as of late. Recent car repair expenses amounted to much more than I anticipated, so that meant cutting back on entertainment for now.



While I can understand the reason for your pricing, a lot of Steam users are not as sympathetic. They have grown used to years of deep discounts and absurdly low prices. The devs for Brigador got complaints for the price of their game, and they responded with this :



http://www.siliconera.com/2016/03/03/brigador-creator-defends-games-price-tag/

I voted on other... I tried the demo but i don't know I just didn't felt any attachment with the cast. The art is great but it did felt a bit weird because I played the first PS and I loved it. I'm not saying the game is bad or anything I just couldn't really "connect" with it.



I don't think the problem comes with PS being an older game because you released a lots of great games since. God know how many times I played Loren even more after the DLC and a certain blue elf became available



Maybe it's like the others says, it's just a bad timing...

The devs for Brigador got complaints for the price of their game, and they responded with this

Haha yes I read that one already! was cool. Here with highest taxes of all Europe, a game sold at $20 on Steam brings me less than 7 eur, so...

Maybe it's like the others says, it's just a bad timing...

It seems I released the game when everyone is broke!!! DAMMMIT

Complaining about price is the kind of a given on steam it's even worse on the play store for android. Last year (I think) Tell Tell offered for free the first episode of S1 of the walking dead, on the comments section users said the game was great but also that they had to paid to continue the game...



I think peoples are getting weird "habits", they don't mind spending between 800 and 1000 € for a phone that they're gonna keep 1 or 2 years but they get all aggressive when they have to pay more than a 10€ for a game. If the game is bad I get that they can be kinda angry but otherwise if it's a good game and they enjoyed it I don't see why they complain.



Sorry for ranting... and deviating from the subject...

Haha no, all my games are always available on linux thanks!

Almost all. There was that zombie survival game that was Windows-only.



Technically I bought the game, but haven't played past what I did during the beta. I had a lot of time in December (but I was waiting on typo fixes so I didn't burn myself out like on SotW), and haven't really had time since with some of the other games I picked up. So I agree a lot on the timing issue.

Complaining about price is the kind of a given on steam it's even worse on the play store for android. Last year (I think) Tell Tell offered for free the first episode of S1 of the walking dead, on the comments section users said the game was great but also that they had to paid to continue the game...



I think peoples are getting weird "habits", they don't mind spending between 800 and 1000 € for a phone that they're gonna keep 1 or 2 years but they get all aggressive when they have to pay more than a 10€ for a game. If the game is bad I get that they can be kinda angry but otherwise if it's a good game and they enjoyed it I don't see why they complain.



Sorry for ranting... and deviating from the subject...

The way I see it, $20 here in the US is a bit over two (non-matinee) movie tickets in most places. So if you spend more than 5 or so hours playing a $20 game, you come out ahead with more entertainment value from your purchase.

Just for my curiosity, what you think of an art style like Vinegaria (Moacube's artist) ? that is better? (I think is amazing but at this point I wonder about my tastes haha).

Just gonna add that I love her art style even though I don't like PSCD's much. So, it's not just because it's not manga style. There're many deviantart artists with non-manga style that I love.

I saw Danko's post on the LemmaSoft forums and although I do have an account there, it's under a different username from here and I thought it'd be more convenient if I commented here instead. ^^



I wanted to comment on the post there, since I actually thought that a lot of his/her points are valid. To give a bit of background info on myself so this doesn't sound like it's coming from someone who's new to the VN/RPG scene (lol), I've been fan of the genre since Hanako Games had some of its first games out, specifically Cute Knight. So it's been quite some years, now that I think about it. Anyway, I've also helped to beta test games although nowadays, I edit and proofread VNs in my free time and I'm paid to do this. (I do have a main job as well so editing and proofreading are work on the side.)



Ok, so on to the actual content. I do agree that it might have been the art that put some people off from buying the game although for me personally, if the writing is really good, the art won't matter. Same goes for other VN elements like music and all that. For me, writing is so important. However, I know that this isn't the case for others. I suppose I prefer to judge a book by its contents rather than on the cover. This has been covered so I won't say anything more about it.



On to what Danko said about editors and writers. Now I don't think you need to hire a professional writer. It is quite costly to do so and I can understand that you might not be able to budget having one. However, I do agree with what was said about hiring an editor. Ok, now it might sound like I'm being biased on the matter since I do edit and perhaps I am but I do think this point is valid, regardless. When I've edited VNs, I do notice things like awkward phrasing of sentences and I do my best to reword them so they sound more natural. Also, when I read through scripts, there are times I notice that something seems weird about a scene or how the characters behave and it's something that I point out. Of course, this could be done intentionally and if that's the case, then it's fine to ignore any criticism I give but otherwise, my input is usually taken into account and certain parts may be rewritten to make more sense. XD If it comes down to not having the budget to hire an editor, it's not necessary to hire a professional one and I do understand that it might be pricey to hire one. However, it might depend on the people who offer to help out with editing. For me, money isn't a huge factor when it comes to editing jobs. I'm more than willing to take on jobs even if the pay is low as long as I like the VN I'm helping to work on and I feel that my input would be valued. ^^ One other thing-I suppose one could argue that beta testers can point out the flaws in English grammar and all that and they do but there are things that can be easily missed so having an editor take care of most, if not all, of the errors.



I don't want to make this post longer than it already is but those are my two cents and all that.

Yes I am reconsidering the use of an editor in particular for long projects. I actually forgot that two of my writers are quite good as editors. Miakoda herself edited a lot of my previous games and she did a good job. Roger Steel writer is also good at editing. Of course for an editor is hard to spot the errors in his/her own writing

I think peoples are getting weird "habits", they don't mind spending between 800 and 1000 € for a phone that they're gonna keep 1 or 2 years but they get all aggressive when they have to pay more than a 10€ for a game. If the game is bad I get that they can be kinda angry but otherwise if it's a good game and they enjoyed it I don't see why they complain.

Haha yes. A classic oatmeal comic comes to mind:

http://s3.amazonaws.com/theoatmeal-img/comics/apps/1.png" style="max-width:100%">

http://s3.amazonaws.com/theoatmeal-img/comics/apps/2.png" style="max-width:100%">

http://s3.amazonaws.com/theoatmeal-img/comics/apps/4.png" style="max-width:100%">

http://s3.amazonaws.com/theoatmeal-img/comics/apps/5.png" style="max-width:100%">

I saw your tweet just now and it did remind me of something, actually. When Hanako Games was first developing Black Closet, there was only one art style. I know that there were people who weren't fans of it so the dev commissioned for a different art style and so players who have the game can choose which art style they prefer to use. I admit that I wasn't a fan of BC's original art but when the second art style came along, that sold me. ^^

Yes of course I was thinking about that too (I know Hanako well since 200.

The big difference in my case is to have the game already released was better if I had this idea BEFORE the release...

Though I guess I could take the chance of the DLC to release a "deluxe/golden version", which would be the same game and previous owner would already have it, with the possibility to choose the character art between two styles (not the romance CGs though, that would be too much!).



Hard to know if it would be worth it though...