myoksy
Feb 05, 2018
Sorry I didn't understand about the SP: you mean that it's possible that steals a float amount, like 0.8?
see
https://imgur.com/a/ev0oc
the rounding issues (sometimes 0 SP damage, sometimes 1) are easiest to comprehend if you try it yourself - nearly all fights in the early days of act 1 work, you need an enemy with around 5 SP
Regarding the interest skill, like also other talents that give an item, I was thinking to allow it ONCE per battle.
that should work, with this change Interest is "only" a powerful shut-down skill
so perhaps I exaggerated a tiny bit
that's an understatement : P
jack1974
Feb 05, 2018
OK so the solution for the SP is to force minimum 1 then
I already put back defense values close to previous values in my version here and I tried that Sylrissa fight with Lizardmen - now she can't kill them with one hit anymore, that's better
Franka
Feb 05, 2018
that's what I will do for sure, at heart I'm a minminner : )
You may recall my minimum QoT run, where I finished at level 6 (with lots of bombs). I'll have to try something similar here. Which background gives access to bombs?
myoksy
Feb 05, 2018
You may recall my minimum QoT run, where I finished at level 6 (with lots of bombs). I'll have to try something similar here. Which background gives access to bombs?
debt collector. and yes, I remember it : )
my playthrough now wasn't that extreme, I did the mandatory fights (duh), the story-driven optional one and a few arena battles (on days where nothing else happened).
before the castle storm the chars had, with two exceptions, level 6 (one was 5, my PC 8 ), and economy-wise it worked quite nicely - I had more or less exactly the 4000 gold I proposed for the end of act 1, or about 500 per char for equipment upgrades. Apo's deus-ex-machina money seems to be fine : )
with the exception of the low defense pacing and combat mechanics were nice. I said it before: more on the easyish side compared to your other RPGs, but I like it.
two notes:
- paralyze resistance: the vampire bosses reduced chains (journeyman) to 1 turn. this is even worse than disabling the skill ; ) [pinning shot, on level 3, shut them down for 2 turns, imo fine for bosses but it shouldn't be lower]
- I'm not sure if I like the slower SP progression - on the one hand the skills shouldn't be used exclusively, on the other hand they create much of the fun. low level chars with less than 10 SP can use maybe 3 to 4 skills before they have to rest/abuse drugs. a little bit to restricted, imo. maybe use the old SP gain formula up to level 10?
myoksy
Feb 05, 2018
and now, for the first time, act 2. until you change *again* some core mechanics and I think it's important to start anew
jack1974
Feb 05, 2018
with the exception of the low defense pacing and combat mechanics were nice. I said it before: more on the easyish side compared to your other RPGs, but I like it.
That was my goal, on normal level at least. I think Hard/Nightmare will still be quite a challenge
two notes:
- paralyze resistance: the vampire bosses reduced chains (journeyman) to 1 turn. this is even worse than disabling the skill ; ) [pinning shot, on level 3, shut them down for 2 turns, imo fine for bosses but it shouldn't be lower]
- I'm not sure if I like the slower SP progression - on the one hand the skills shouldn't be used exclusively, on the other hand they create much of the fun. low level chars with less than 10 SP can use maybe 3 to 4 skills before they have to rest/abuse drugs. a little bit to restricted, imo. maybe use the old SP gain formula up to level 10?
The thing about chain is that it also reduces SP. So it's even more powerful, it's like pinning shot combined with debilitate. That said it should behave like pinning shot for duration at least, so I'll check that.
I could use the old system, or simply start with a minimum SP (for players). Like minimum 5 (already from 1st level) since that plus 1 every 2 levels would be the same amount at level 10.
myoksy
Feb 05, 2018
I am aware that chains is powerful. but within the constraints of your combat system one turn of paralyze is like a big middlefinger in the face of the player : D
Franka
Feb 05, 2018
I rushed through the game without doing much of anything and almost finished at lv9 on the main character. I say almost, because a strange bug happened. On the second part of the Harsilia fight, Hersilia is already dead (I killed her in the first fight). If I use Valery's blood, I enter a fight with "Empty" opponents. If I don't, I enter a fight where Hersilia starts out dead but the rest of the opponents are there.
Oh, and the game is ridiculously easy on "Easy", so I doubt I'll need any bombs.
jack1974
Feb 05, 2018
I am aware that chains is powerful. but within the constraints of your combat system one turn of paralyze is like a big middlefinger in the face of the player : D
Well because is Journeyman, if was Expert would be two turns. There isn't much I could do to solve that issue, except that with bosses the paralyze trick doesn't work. It was like that also in my other RPGs
On the second part of the Harsilia fight, Hersilia is already dead (I killed her in the first fight). If I use Valery's blood, I enter a fight with "Empty" opponents. If I don't, I enter a fight where Hersilia starts out dead but the rest of the opponents are there.
Ah that happened to me while testing but I used a cheat mode to instantly kill all enemies. I didn't think this was possible in a normal playthrough
I'll do a check to avoid this, but probably also raised a bit Easy, I mean still easy but not like now
Franka
Feb 05, 2018
Ah that happened to me while testing but I used a cheat mode to instantly kill all enemies. I didn't think this was possible in a normal playthrough
I'll do a check to avoid this, but probably also raised a bit Easy, I mean still easy but not like now
I'd think you'd know better after I broke all those timed fights in SotW.... Players will ALWAYS find a way to kill your stuff instantly.
myoksy
Feb 05, 2018
> here isn't much I could do to solve that issue
are you sure? I think at least one of your games had 2 turns as lower limit for all shut-down skills/levels
> except that with bosses the paralyze trick doesn't work
that's always a solution (and a cheap way out : P)
Franka
Feb 05, 2018
Another thing. I tried the act 2 end fight both by killing all 5 waves or by making all lieutenants flee. Either way, Z&V give me items for defeating the lieutenants. Technically, I haven't even met them yet if I just fight off all the undead hordes.
myoksy
Feb 05, 2018
the end of act one is similar - even if the PC let them flee V* gives out the goodies, and the narrative is "oh, how I loved to hear <bla> die painfully". so I think this should be okay for the second chapter
*) she has a companion? who's Z?
Franka
Feb 05, 2018
the end of act one is similar - even if the PC let them flee V* gives out the goodies
Yes, but you can choose to just make one of them flee then escape yourself, and you only get a reward for that one. In the second act you can get rewards for all of them without so much as meeting them.
jack1974
Feb 06, 2018
I'd think you'd know better after I broke all those timed fights in SotW.... Players will ALWAYS find a way to kill your stuff instantly.
Good point
> here isn't much I could do to solve that issue
are you sure? I think at least one of your games had 2 turns as lower limit for all shut-down skills/levels
It might be, I don't remember now
But I think even 2 turns on a boss enemy would be too much maybe. I remember in Loren (or was SOTW?) paralyze didn't work at all on bosses and even the skill description said something like "doesn't work on boss enemies"
Yes, but you can choose to just make one of them flee then escape yourself, and you only get a reward for that one. In the second act you can get rewards for all of them without so much as meeting them.
Well: it's correct that you get the item even if you only make them escape (not necessarily kill them). However from what you say, it seems that at end of act 2 you got items for vampires you defeated at end of act1? If so, then that's wrong and if you had a save before that scene happens would be useful
In practice I made two lists: in one I add the vampires "defeated" (killed or just made flee away) and then I check. Then on end of act2 I have another list that should count only the vampires defeated during the battle of Grimoire, not the ones before. I checked the code again and I don't understand how this could happen since I store the values on two different variables
Franka
Feb 06, 2018
Well: it's correct that you get the item even if you only make them escape (not necessarily kill them). However from what you say, it seems that at end of act 2 you got items for vampires you defeated at end of act1? If so, then that's wrong and if you had a save before that scene happens would be useful
In practice I made two lists: in one I add the vampires "defeated" (killed or just made flee away) and then I check. Then on end of act2 I have another list that should count only the vampires defeated during the battle of Grimoire, not the ones before. I checked the code again and I don't understand how this could happen since I store the values on two different variables
No, no. I only kill/social 1 vampire lieutenant at the end of act 1. In act 2, I don't kill/social ANY vampire lieutenant, I just kill 5 hordes of undead to end the battle. Z&V then show up afterwards, tell me I dealt with remaining 3 vampire lieutenants (using their names, which I've never heard before), and give me loot.
Act 2 battle can be won either by just killing minions, just "killing" lieutenants, or a mix of both. But I'm given rewards for the lieutenants whether I "kill" them or not.
jack1974
Feb 06, 2018
Yeah that's a problem then
However I just tried here to kill only undead waves and the vampires didn't visit me afterwards (correctly). So if you have a save before the battle or even before the vampires visit you, I'd like to see it. I'm not sure how that could happen to be honest
Franka
Feb 06, 2018
Hmm, you're right, I can't replicate it, it looks like I got my save games mixed up. Strange, I was sure that happened the first time, but it looks like all is well!
Franka
Feb 06, 2018
Ahh, I know what happened. I didn't finish the game the first time around because of the Hersilia is already dead bug, so I went back and on the second run kiled the lieutenants.
myoksy
Feb 06, 2018
the skill description said something like "doesn't work on boss enemies"
iirc this was true in your older RPGs for many special skills - and I didn't like it that much, as it's such an artificial restriction without a real in-game explanation.
next to removing all shut down skills in Future RPG(tm) [I believe I already mentioned this sometime?] another option could be redefining paralyse, with a mechanic similar to older variants of counter attack: The skill works for a number of turns as power off, but additionally every attack removes one point of the effect. This could solve the current problem with chains/pinning/shield bash/whatever: While the effect is on the char is a free-for-all crash test dummy. When attacks remove the effect it would work as a temporary truce and does not act only when not attacked.
